besides PE EQ ratio vs RPM...
#1
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 27,564
Likes: 4
From: Maryland
I am commanding for 11.46 @ 4800 and the WB is showing 12.01 to 12.1 in that range. Besides making the adjustment in this table, is there some other steps to go at this the "right" way? I really hate patching a table to get something to read the way I want it.
#2
the math will never add up with the pe divisor, Ive tried for a year now maybe its just my engine. If your within .5 afr of commanded and actual Id say your doing very good. Even if your ve is perfect and commanding 14.7 in that area when not in pe then throw in pe there will always be small fluctuations. I think there are other things that come into play.
Id like it if all the math lined up and it worked perfectly like it should but we arent dealing with race engines or pcm's designed for what we are doing with them.
my .02
Id like it if all the math lined up and it worked perfectly like it should but we arent dealing with race engines or pcm's designed for what we are doing with them.
my .02
Last edited by 02sierraz71_5.3; Feb 21, 2006 at 08:23 PM.
#3
Messing with a guys car the other day and had the same results.
Off probably a good .7 of a point.
Formula showed .7+ than actual A/F.
No biggie, just takes a few more logs to nail the target.
Off probably a good .7 of a point.
Formula showed .7+ than actual A/F.
No biggie, just takes a few more logs to nail the target.
#4
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 27,564
Likes: 4
From: Maryland
Originally Posted by 02sierraz71_5.3
the math will never add up with the pe divisor, Ive tried for a year now maybe its just my engine. If your within .5 afr of commanded and actual Id say your doing very good. Even if your ve is perfect and commanding 14.7 in that area when not in pe then throw in pe there will always be small fluctuations. I think there are other things that come into play.
Id like it if all the math lined up and it worked perfectly like it should but we arent dealing with race engines or pcm's designed for what we are doing with them.
my .02
Id like it if all the math lined up and it worked perfectly like it should but we arent dealing with race engines or pcm's designed for what we are doing with them.
my .02
thanx as well sportside!
#5
It's tough to get the MAF frequency table nailed down due to the high level of precision it has, but it is the biggie here, especially considering your setup.
I don't see anything in your sig saying that you're running a 2 bar MAP, so I assume you're still with a 1 bar tune, which means VE has effectively nothing to do with your fueling in boost.
Work on tuning the MAF Frequency table. It's close from the factory, but as you can see, it's not perfect. Hard part of this is to get a lot of data for each of those high frequency cells, you're going to have to really spend some time in boost. A real bummer huh.
My doing this has brought my actual AFR up to 11.4 with a target of 11.6. Stopped fine tuning it at that point for my drive across the country.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that my 11.4 achievement is on average for a 30minute drive. There's really nothing you can do about the fluctuations around that average that'll occur. My WB will show 11.2 one frame, 11,4 the next, then 11.9, back to 11.0 the next but the overal avg works out to be close to target and all the while there is plenty of fuel to keep the temps low enough to avoid detonation.
I don't see anything in your sig saying that you're running a 2 bar MAP, so I assume you're still with a 1 bar tune, which means VE has effectively nothing to do with your fueling in boost.
Work on tuning the MAF Frequency table. It's close from the factory, but as you can see, it's not perfect. Hard part of this is to get a lot of data for each of those high frequency cells, you're going to have to really spend some time in boost. A real bummer huh.

My doing this has brought my actual AFR up to 11.4 with a target of 11.6. Stopped fine tuning it at that point for my drive across the country.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that my 11.4 achievement is on average for a 30minute drive. There's really nothing you can do about the fluctuations around that average that'll occur. My WB will show 11.2 one frame, 11,4 the next, then 11.9, back to 11.0 the next but the overal avg works out to be close to target and all the while there is plenty of fuel to keep the temps low enough to avoid detonation.
#6
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 27,564
Likes: 4
From: Maryland
Originally Posted by dc_justin
It's tough to get the MAF frequency table nailed down due to the high level of precision it has, but it is the biggie here, especially considering your setup.
I don't see anything in your sig saying that you're running a 2 bar MAP, so I assume you're still with a 1 bar tune, which means VE has effectively nothing to do with your fueling in boost.
Work on tuning the MAF Frequency table. It's close from the factory, but as you can see, it's not perfect. Hard part of this is to get a lot of data for each of those high frequency cells, you're going to have to really spend some time in boost. A real bummer huh.
My doing this has brought my actual AFR up to 11.4 with a target of 11.6. Stopped fine tuning it at that point for my drive across the country.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that my 11.4 achievement is on average for a 30minute drive. There's really nothing you can do about the fluctuations around that average that'll occur. My WB will show 11.2 one frame, 11,4 the next, then 11.9, back to 11.0 the next but the overal avg works out to be close to target and all the while there is plenty of fuel to keep the temps low enough to avoid detonation.
I don't see anything in your sig saying that you're running a 2 bar MAP, so I assume you're still with a 1 bar tune, which means VE has effectively nothing to do with your fueling in boost.
Work on tuning the MAF Frequency table. It's close from the factory, but as you can see, it's not perfect. Hard part of this is to get a lot of data for each of those high frequency cells, you're going to have to really spend some time in boost. A real bummer huh.

My doing this has brought my actual AFR up to 11.4 with a target of 11.6. Stopped fine tuning it at that point for my drive across the country.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that my 11.4 achievement is on average for a 30minute drive. There's really nothing you can do about the fluctuations around that average that'll occur. My WB will show 11.2 one frame, 11,4 the next, then 11.9, back to 11.0 the next but the overal avg works out to be close to target and all the while there is plenty of fuel to keep the temps low enough to avoid detonation.
quiet a bit.Yeh, I didn't do the 2 bar cuz I just couldn't (at the time) talk myself into spending the extra 200 bones for it. I was paying for enough mods, seemed enough people are okay on the 1 bar. I would probably like the 2 bar alot more. It's driving me nuts that I can't get a handle on tip in fueling for WOT. That initial burst 0% to 100% gives me kr about 40% of the time. I don't know how else to tune it....it goes to the top of the map to soon and hell with the stall and cam I am already in 3200/1.04g/cyl. Everybody with pulleys smaller than 3" has to be going nuts with tuning for it.
Over on tech Jimmyblue pointed out the about the same thing...MAF and usually alot suffer fromt the imperfection of fuel pressure. Think rail is at a particualr pressure and it's really a few ticks below will certainly cause the differene of .7 in the final afr. Also a posible leak...hmmm...I do have a lazy o2 every so often.
I guess I will beat this MAF tuning into the ground and see where I stand then.
I have spent a fortune on broken ****. I am just not gonna accept a 12:1 afr. I know it's probably safe enough for FI...I just want to be on the otherside(11.5) a little more.
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#8
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 27,564
Likes: 4
From: Maryland
02sierraz71
I am giving it a shot. Your's seems just fine as well...If things get out of hand I'll fix the maf with your way. eg; -7 trim in a certain hz range should be multiplied by .93 eh? Hell in my tuning log book your write ups are in the front.
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