I don't think im feeding anyone b.s.. I have been in the audio realm for a long time as well. Your right feeding subs off a 4 channel amp isn't the norm. However an external crossover will cure that issue.....OR you can use the crossover built into most head units. Remember he would still be using the Sub outputs on the head unit to feed this amp. Bottom line an amp is an amp. The only major difference other than frequency response between a dedicated sub amp and a full range amp is it’s built in crossover. Yes with a sub amp you get some bass boost controls and a few other gadgets that some people use but most abuse. Garageman has mentioned SEVERAL times that he really wants a two channel sub stage. This CANNOT be done with a mono block amp.....unless he buys two of them.

As far as the oversized mid-bass driver.....I don't get that one if he crosses them over correctly. And by his knowledge of home audio equipment im sure he could figure that one out.

I have owned and listened to several JL audio subs and have never been dissatisfied.


EDIT: its too early to spell correctly......had to spell check some things.

 

Okay well I looked at the new pioneer head. It looks to be much better than the old ones and VERY snappy compared to them too. Well I know I can set crossovers. Heck I do it with my current setup. It is a 2 channel "600 watt" amp. I have them bridged into 1 and my crossovers set right.

On my high dollar dual deck <dont make fun of me too much, it was free lol. It is only a cheap thing and it has 4 channels. 2 for the front and 2 for either Sub, or Rears. I currently have it set to rears so I can get fullrange sound to my rears. I have a splitter deal in there so I can run it for both amps. Then at the amp it has crossover settings so I can make it sound like a sub cutting out all the fullrange sounds.

I would imagine a $400 pioneer deck is going to have some settings that allow control over what the head unit sends out am I right or wrong on thinking this? I have seen it before but i have no idea if this head allows that. It is just what would make sense to myself. I would prefer not to go the monoblock way. Call me picky but yea ha.



Michael

 

Ok, I've been working alot lately, and it seems this thread has taken on a life of it's on, and started to be filled with some BS...so I will clear some things up.

1. Amps. Depending on what you're wanting to accomplish, running a single 4 channel to run both speakers and subs isn't a bad idea at all. Pretty much all 4 channels have the ability to set a LPF on either 1 or both pairs of speaker outputs to let them be properly used for running subwoofers. I keep seeing CC05 talking down about the Alpine MRP/MRX amplifiers, and you couldn't be farther from the truth about their lack of quality, and tendency to run hot. I have installed literally hundreds of this line of amplifier and I would venture so far as to say the failure rate of these is less than 5% (can sundown say that?). But to criticize any company about the thermal tendencies of their amps and to recommend Sundown (a company who's amps are capable of cooking a fried egg) is ludicrous. I would suggest sticking with the alpine amps you were looking at originally, those two sundown amps are insanely huge and require much more current than your factory alternator can supply without voltage drop (which will yet again make them run hotter) and the much complained about dimming of the lights.

2. Subwoofers. There are always better companies out there, but in an extended cab, you're going to be stuck trying to use slim line subs which isn't always a good thing. The Kicker Comp VT's recommended aren't the greatest as they still require a large enclosure which pretty much goes against what a slim line sub is designed for. For that you would be better off looking at a JL 13TW5 if you can afford it, or Pioneer Shallow mount subs which are known as one of the best slim designed subs around.

3. Components. While I won't argue that Focal and CDT make great products, the ones recommended are entry level speakers which wouldn't be able to hold a candle to the performance of The infinity Kappa Perfects you were looking at originally. While they're far from my favorite components, they do perform well depending on the amount of money you're paying for them.

4. Sound deadening, for the money you should look into second skin, or stinger road kill. Dynamat is one of the best known companies, but you are paying quite a bit of mark up for the name. Second skin also sells a product called luxury liner pro that is a combination of CCF and MLV that will greatly reduce the amount of road noise inside your truck.

5. Wiring: I personally prefer Stinger Expert wiring, but it is FAR from the cheapest out there. If nothing else buy their Expert RCA's as they're some of the highest quality RCA's I've ever encountered.


Garageman, If you could give me a budget you're trying to work in, or even PM me if you're rather not say, I can make some better recommendations, but what you were originally looking at would suite you quite well. The only problem I see is with the subs, and the box you're looking at, it wont provide enough mounting depth for the subs.

 

Stereo substage isn't really that important because below a certain frequency (usually 80-100hz) in most vehicles, sound is no longer directional meaning you can't pinpoint it's exact location, so having multichannel sub isn't necessary. In fact with a proper signal processor and delay you can actually get your sub to sound like it's coming from your dash (which is how my truck is setup).

again, not true. JL designed the W0 line of subwoofers to be used in a sealed environment. Much like Kicker's comp line of subwoofers, their suspension was designed intentionally weak to let them be used in small sealed enclosures while still retaining their efficiency.

While this does go some what "against the grain" it's not atypical. The way I describe it to my customers is think of your vehicle like a concert, when you're there the performers and music is setup on stage (in front of you) why would you want to hear it coming from behind you, that would be like turning your back to the stage for the entire performance. At the end of the day, you're not trying to compete in SQ competitions, so set your truck up however you prefer, but if you do want sound coming from all around, I would suggest modifying your rear speaker locations to house larger speakers as they're going to be competing with your substage.

Actually I believe stereo subs to be a detriment because if your music starts shifting from side to side (like it sometimes is recorded), you're going to have one of your subs not playing each time which will cut your sub output by half which would sound quite strange. I would say stick with mono sub, but again, that just my $.02. The nice thing about stereos is there is no right or wrong way of listening, it all comes down to your preferences and how it sounds to you. You could listen to my truck and absolutely hate it, but it sounds great to me...and vice versa.

 

True....it does become a little difficult to hear when in a compressed environment like a car. I was baseing what I have done with my home theater setup which is WAY more open than a car environment. I was just keeping my suggestions with what Garageman had his mind set to. You BY FAR have set some false claims posted here straight! Thanks for the chime in!!!

 

Refer to other thread. You internet geniuses are killing me.

 

It all comes down to wavelengths. In lower frequencies the wavelength is longer than the cabin is large, so you can't pinpoint where the sound is coming from. This is still an issue in home theater, but the frequencies are lower before you notice. Apparently CC05 is just upset because someone doesn't just blindly follow bad advice. Otherwise, anything that isn't sold on sonic Electronics is garbage and overpriced. I guess I should just throw my Arc black series components in the garbage and buy some entry level focal pieces pwoered by Sundown audio amps that are going to pop everytime I turn it on and off.

...if by internet genius you mean over a decade in the industry. Please correct any of my statements you find are flawed.

 

Yep....wavelenghts get pretty long in the subwoofer range. Thats why t-line boxes are so big!

 

I don't know how much more plainly I can put that I'm not upset. Being in the industry does not mean a damn thing. I promise you it doesn't amount to ****. I know guys who have been in the auto parts industry for twenty years. They don't know ****. I know guys who have done audio for years on end, as I mentioned earlier. They don't know ****. I know businesses who have been run by people who have been "in the industry" for years, and they are running their businesses *** backwards. All of that, because years "in the industry" don't amount to ****, in most cases. If you're recommending mainstream stuff over lesser-known stuff, that's better quality, you're a typical audio dealer/installer. Focal doesn't make junk, and their lower level stuff isn't junk either. I worked at a shop for years. Sonic has overhead just like a shop. Warehouses, staff, etc. Shops have no more overhead than an internet retailer of that sort, in this case. Shops overcharge. Period. Senseless bastards that have been "in the industry" are to blame. You're obviously one of those brilliant minds, seeing as how you STILL haven't picked up on how I'm neither offended, nor not new to the audio scene. You'll carry on in this thread, yet not reply to my other comment to you on another thread where I offered you the last word. People really do blow my mind. I appreciate you gracing me with your pure intellect.

 

Really????