Originally Posted by AKlowriderZ71

Thanks for the extra info Billy, even though it's a little vague. It's actually about the same answer that I've gotten from anybody I have ever asked. But I'll never turn down an opportunity to ask an expert(such as your pop). I guess the general rule of thumb is, change them before they break. lol

My Crane duals have been on for over 40K miles. I'd never ever run any spring that had been recommended to replace at 20K intervals. That's insane. My thoughts were to swap them out around 60K-ish, but I really don't even know why. Just being cautious I guess.

Originally Posted by JFOLM

Where do you get a projected life span such as 60k miles? Just from your knowledge or from the manufacturer? I would think it all depends on the driver characteristics, cam lift, vehicle setup, etc. etc.

Originally Posted by JFOLM

Billy, they are out of NJ. Not sure if you knew that or not.

Originally Posted by CashDudeHomie

I ran Comp 918s for a few months before BOOM.

A bunch of new parts later, I went with Patriots and ran them for 15 months with no problems. I replaced them with more Patriots just to be safe. None of the first set had broken inner or outer springs.

I did have a camshaft failure on the second set of Patriots, but I think it was a quality control problem with the cam hardening that progressively got worse until a lifter spun on it.

Originally Posted by budhayes3

I was grilling my pop this morning for some valve spring info ... . I asked him his opinion on beehives vs. duals and titanium vs. steel vs. the new lightened steel retainers.

First, he doesn't like beehives, says that he's seen too many of them break and doesn't like not having the added security of a second spring to help save the valve/piston. I told him how a vast majority of the LS guys run them with great results, and he said that's cool, but he personally doesn't like building them on the engines that he builds.

Then I was asking him about spring manufacturers...he told me that there are only about 4 companies who make springs and sell them to the other companies, the biggest being Associated, who also makes a lot of OEM stuff. He prefers Manley Nextek, Isky, and PAC. According to pop, Patriots are garbage, and he hardly ever uses Comp springs, unless he has a weird application that only Comp offers a spring for. He's not really familiar with PRC or who supplies their springs/spring wire. I did mention to him that PRC has a great track record on PT.net.

Lastly I asked him about titanium vs. steel retainers. He told me that he uses titanium retainers on every engine that he builds, as the light weight of the ti retainers are good for an extra 300-400 usable RPM over a steel retainer. He learned this from research that he did using his engine dyno (every engine that he builds and sells gets dyno'd before it leaves his shop). I inquired about the longevity of ti retainers as I've heard that they have a tendency to wear out prematurely, and he said that he's only seen this as a problem on springs with flat dampers, which may dig into the retainer. He said that this isn't a problem on springs where the end is round. He mentioned that there are new lightweight steel retainers that are 33% lighter then regular hardened steel retainers, for folks who are hell bent on running steel retainers.

As I said above, he prefers Manley and Isky for springs, but he noted that not too many folks consider them when choosing springs since they don't have big full page ads like Comp and Crane.

I'm sure that a lot of guys will have their own opinions, and we'll see a lot of "well I've been running x-brand spring for x-amount of time and never had a problem", and that's all well and good. ...

Off topic, but speaking of my dad, he called me yesterday and let me know that he is currently building a LSx block, which will check in just under 427 cid when he's done with it. I'm pretty sure that this will be his first GENIII build, and the engine is going into a 60's street/strip Chevy if I'm not mistaken...can't remember if it's a Chevelle, Nova, or what. I do remember that it will have CP pistons, Cometic head gaskets, heads that will be supplied by the gentleman that supplies MAST with their heads, and I believe the cam grind will be from the same gent. The cam is going to have .24x/.24-25x duration, and a 113-114 LSA. The intake will be a custom sheetmetal intake, that will be used not only for performance, but for styling as the owner of the muscle car is going for a certain look. Another reason for this style intake is that the engine will be ProCharged, and when my dad talked to FAST they didn't recommend one of their plastic intakes which won't be able to hold together under the planned boost levels this engine will see. When all is said and done, the mill should produce 900-1000 crank horsepower, which my dad will verify on his engine dyno. I asked him if he has everything that he needs to hook and LSx up to his dyno, and he said no problemo as the engine will be using a FAST controller and stand alone harness. I'll be sure to keep an eye on this build as I'm extremely excited that my pop finally has some new gen Chevy stuff in his shop...good practice for when we build my LQ9

Originally Posted by budhayes3

... Once it's all done I'll try to snap a decent pic of the dyno sheet also I'll find out what the whole deal is gonna cost too...I know it won't be cheap, as we all know how much the LSx stuff costs, and my pop is quite expensive on the labor end also

Originally Posted by budhayes3

Haven't been able to get over to my dad's shop, but I did talk to him today and asked him this question. He said that it varies from application to application and spring to spring, and of course how hard you beat on them. I asked if they should be checked periodically and he mentioned that only problem with checking them is that you can only check them statically and can't check them dynamically. A spring may check good on the bench but still not function properly while in use, or at a certain RPM. He did give me a few examples though...the majority of the bracket engines that he builds are usually good for between 400-600 runs, spinning to 7500-8000, (maybe 3 seasons or so). Pro-Stock drag racers usually use their springs for 1 or 2 runs then chuck them. The highest funded Top Fuel teams only use their springs for 1 run.

He also told me of how certain springs don't like certain RPM's, like one spring won't do well idling and another won't do well above 7500 RPM etc, ...

He made sure to make a point that the most important thing is to keep it light on the valve side, light retainers, keepers, valves etc, but it's not as important on the pushrod side. He uses duals and titanium retainers on everything he builds, and even titanium valves on the highest end stuff. He told me to buy the best springs that money can buy...(money, what's that? ) And again he listed Manley Nextek, PSI, Isky and PAC as the tops. (He listed the first 3 and I mentioned PAC and he agreed that they were of the highest quality) ...

Originally Posted by AKlowriderZ71

It's really just a WAG(wild *** guess). ... Maybe I'll call Roger Vinci and get his opinion.

Originally Posted by JFOLM

I see. I called Manley themselves and asked how often I should check and he didn't really give me any info. He said,

Billy, they are out of NJ. Not sure if you knew that or not.