Dry or Wet?
07-31-2005, 07:15 PM
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Dry or Wet?
I am thinking of putting nitrous on my truck in the somewhat near future. I was thinking of going dry but I haven't made up my mind yet. I know I will have to upgrade my injectors and probably my fuel pump. What is the actual risk of having a nitrous explosion with a wet kit? I here about it alot but dont see it that often. Is there something you do to prevent nitrous explosions with a wet kit? I have never delt with nitrous before so I am trying gain as much knowledge before I make up my mind.
08-01-2005, 06:38 AM
#2
Go wet it is much better and easier on your engine. The stock fuel system can handle up to a 150 wet shot and thats the most you should go anyway IMO to keep it reliable. As far as puddling in the intake and causing an explosion dont spray under 3000rpm. I have sprayed many times out of the hole with my 3000 stall and havent had a problem. I have a wet system and am very happy plus you are alot less likely to run lean.
08-01-2005, 02:10 PM
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There are two ways of running a dry shot on our trucks. The fist which is like the NOS-5177 kit sprays the nitrous through the MAF and the computer reads it as very dense cold air and adds more fuel. The second, similar to a NOS-5176 kit, routs some of the nitrous onto the fuel pressure regulator, using the nitrous bottle pressure to raise the fuel pressure and more fuel is added thusly.
Wet shot is fairly straightforward. Fuel and nitrous are added together. Fuel can be tapped from the existing fuel system or it can have its own independent fuel system.
Wets do tend to hit harder and tend to be easier on the motor. Drys tend to be safer, in that there is no fuel solenoid failure to deal with, and has a similar installation.
Wet shot is fairly straightforward. Fuel and nitrous are added together. Fuel can be tapped from the existing fuel system or it can have its own independent fuel system.
Wets do tend to hit harder and tend to be easier on the motor. Drys tend to be safer, in that there is no fuel solenoid failure to deal with, and has a similar installation.
08-01-2005, 03:34 PM
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Two things must be considered to be predictable and safe to operate nitrous all the time:
1.) Constant Fuel pressure for accurate metering (This can be fuel delivery or adjusting WOT pressure at the point where the fuel is being drawn from)
2.) Constant Nitrous pressure for accurate metering (This means use of a bottle warmer and making sure that the excessive air is not the line.)
Considerations for types of delivery methods
Wet
1. Multiple fogger system (with injection happening in each individual runner.)
- This system has a fuel source tap that should be in the regulated part of your fuel system or from a stand alone source (nitrous fuel cell) Maintaining proper pressure will ensure the right amount of fuel is delivered at the time of injection.
- This system will inject a nitrous and fuel enriched plume into each individual runner. Distribution is well balanced and very accurate. Per cylinder tuning is possible this way.
- Typically due the to locality of the nitrous injection point, the delivery time is faster leading to a more noticeable activation point (This is the "hardest hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning.
2. A single or multiple fogger system (with injection happening just behind the MAF and introducing a nitrous and fuel plume in the primary intake tract)
- This system has a fuel source tap that should be in the regulated part of your fuel system or from a stand alone source (nitrous fuel cell) Maintaining proper pressure will ensure the right amount of fuel is delivered at the time of injection.
- This system will inject a nitrous and fuel enriched plume into the main plenum for distribution through the manifold and individual runners. Distribution is only as good as manifold design allows. Some cylinders will get more and some less. A consideration to at this point is that the manifold as designed for our vehicles is not a WET manifold and thereby does not take into consideration the variable needed to carry a fuel enriched charge through the runner (some fuel will fall out of suspension and puddling may occur.)
- Typically due the to the nitrous being independently operated outside of intervention of the computer, the delivery time is faster leading to a more noticeable activation point (This is the "hard hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning.
3. Plate system (with injection happening behind the throttle body via spray bars.)
- This system is very similar in performance compared to a single or multiple fogger type injection system as outlined above.
- This system has a fuel source tap that should be in the regulated part of your fuel system or from a stand alone source (nitrous fuel cell) Maintaining proper pressure will ensure the right amount of fuel is delivered at the time of injection.
- This system will inject a nitrous and fuel enriched plume into the main plenum for distribution through the manifold and individual runners. A spray bar can create a much broader, larger plume than with a fogger type injector. Distribution is still only as good as manifold design allows. Some cylinders will get more and some less. A consideration to at this point is that the manifold as designed for our vehicles is not a WET manifold and thereby does not take into consideration the variable needed to carry a fuel enriched charge through the runner (some fuel will fall out of suspension and puddling may occur.)
- Typically due the to the nitrous being independently operated outside of intervention of the computer, the delivery time is faster leading to a more noticeable activation point (This is the "hard hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning.
Dry
1. Fuel boosting single and multiple fogger (Bypass type fuel system - injection of nitrous alone AFTER the air meter using mechanically increased fuel pressure to compensate for addition fuel demand.)
- This system relies upon the fuel injection systems normal delivery method to increase fuel to meet nitrous demand. In this case the nitrous system mechanically raises fuel pressure in the system to increase flow per injector pulse. This method relies upon specific knowledge of the capacity of the injector’s duty cycle and fuel delivery system. Both pump and injectors must be adequate to flow the needed fuel.
- This system will inject nitrous only in to the intake tract behind the air meter and relies upon a regulator sensing the increased pressure in the nitrous line to force the fuel pressure regulator to hold higher pressure. No fuel is added to the manifold outside of normal operation of the injectors.
- Typically due the to the nitrous being injected far before the point where fuel is injected, the fuel ratio tends to tip rich first and then is corrected quickly there after once the nitrous reaches the cylinder. The delivery time is slower leading to a less noticeable activation point (This is the "soft hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning, however, should nitrous pressure fall or nitrous concentration lower, the compensation will be on the rich side posing less potential danger.
2.MASS-AIR / MAF compensating (MASS AIR / MAF injection of nitrous BEFORE the air meter using MAF fueling tables to increase fuel pressure to compensate for additional oxygen provided by nitrous.
- This system relies upon the fuel injection systems normal delivery method to increase fuel to meet nitrous demand. In this case the nitrous system mechanically raises fuel pressure in the system to increase flow per injector pulse. This method relies upon specific knowledge of the capacity of the injector’s duty cycle and fuel delivery system. Both pump and injectors must be adequate to flow the needed fuel.
- This system will inject nitrous only into the intake tract before the air meter and relies upon MAF readings to properly change injector operation to flow the additional fuel. No fuel is added to the manifold outside of normal operation of the injectors.
- Typically due the to the nitrous being injected far before the point where fuel is injected, the fuel ratio tends to tip rich first and then is corrected quickly there after once the nitrous reaches the cylinder. The delivery time is slower leading to a less noticeable activation point (This is the "soft hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning, however, should nitrous pressure fall or nitrous concentration lower, the compensation will be on the rich side posing less potential danger.
I have run both and both are equally effective. Nitrous is simple BUT its simplicity is what can make it easy to misuse.
For a race application Wet is the most cost effective and a very accurate means of injection. IN race applications where fuel pressure and nitrous pressure are monitored and kept in check the benefits are great.
For street I prefer Dry. Lack of preparedness will not lead to the potential puddling and subsequent damage that can be attributed to such conditions as low bottle pressure or failure to open the bottle or sticky clogged fuel solenoids.
Any application can lead to motor failure if not properly kept in check. Maintaining you vehicle (frequent plug checks and system nitrous and fuel filter checks), understanding WHEN you can most effectively inject nitrous in the powerband and being able to pick out those noises or other symptoms of a mistuned or malfunctioning nitrous system are important in all cases.
Richard
1.) Constant Fuel pressure for accurate metering (This can be fuel delivery or adjusting WOT pressure at the point where the fuel is being drawn from)
2.) Constant Nitrous pressure for accurate metering (This means use of a bottle warmer and making sure that the excessive air is not the line.)
Considerations for types of delivery methods
Wet
1. Multiple fogger system (with injection happening in each individual runner.)
- This system has a fuel source tap that should be in the regulated part of your fuel system or from a stand alone source (nitrous fuel cell) Maintaining proper pressure will ensure the right amount of fuel is delivered at the time of injection.
- This system will inject a nitrous and fuel enriched plume into each individual runner. Distribution is well balanced and very accurate. Per cylinder tuning is possible this way.
- Typically due the to locality of the nitrous injection point, the delivery time is faster leading to a more noticeable activation point (This is the "hardest hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning.
2. A single or multiple fogger system (with injection happening just behind the MAF and introducing a nitrous and fuel plume in the primary intake tract)
- This system has a fuel source tap that should be in the regulated part of your fuel system or from a stand alone source (nitrous fuel cell) Maintaining proper pressure will ensure the right amount of fuel is delivered at the time of injection.
- This system will inject a nitrous and fuel enriched plume into the main plenum for distribution through the manifold and individual runners. Distribution is only as good as manifold design allows. Some cylinders will get more and some less. A consideration to at this point is that the manifold as designed for our vehicles is not a WET manifold and thereby does not take into consideration the variable needed to carry a fuel enriched charge through the runner (some fuel will fall out of suspension and puddling may occur.)
- Typically due the to the nitrous being independently operated outside of intervention of the computer, the delivery time is faster leading to a more noticeable activation point (This is the "hard hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning.
3. Plate system (with injection happening behind the throttle body via spray bars.)
- This system is very similar in performance compared to a single or multiple fogger type injection system as outlined above.
- This system has a fuel source tap that should be in the regulated part of your fuel system or from a stand alone source (nitrous fuel cell) Maintaining proper pressure will ensure the right amount of fuel is delivered at the time of injection.
- This system will inject a nitrous and fuel enriched plume into the main plenum for distribution through the manifold and individual runners. A spray bar can create a much broader, larger plume than with a fogger type injector. Distribution is still only as good as manifold design allows. Some cylinders will get more and some less. A consideration to at this point is that the manifold as designed for our vehicles is not a WET manifold and thereby does not take into consideration the variable needed to carry a fuel enriched charge through the runner (some fuel will fall out of suspension and puddling may occur.)
- Typically due the to the nitrous being independently operated outside of intervention of the computer, the delivery time is faster leading to a more noticeable activation point (This is the "hard hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning.
Dry
1. Fuel boosting single and multiple fogger (Bypass type fuel system - injection of nitrous alone AFTER the air meter using mechanically increased fuel pressure to compensate for addition fuel demand.)
- This system relies upon the fuel injection systems normal delivery method to increase fuel to meet nitrous demand. In this case the nitrous system mechanically raises fuel pressure in the system to increase flow per injector pulse. This method relies upon specific knowledge of the capacity of the injector’s duty cycle and fuel delivery system. Both pump and injectors must be adequate to flow the needed fuel.
- This system will inject nitrous only in to the intake tract behind the air meter and relies upon a regulator sensing the increased pressure in the nitrous line to force the fuel pressure regulator to hold higher pressure. No fuel is added to the manifold outside of normal operation of the injectors.
- Typically due the to the nitrous being injected far before the point where fuel is injected, the fuel ratio tends to tip rich first and then is corrected quickly there after once the nitrous reaches the cylinder. The delivery time is slower leading to a less noticeable activation point (This is the "soft hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning, however, should nitrous pressure fall or nitrous concentration lower, the compensation will be on the rich side posing less potential danger.
2.MASS-AIR / MAF compensating (MASS AIR / MAF injection of nitrous BEFORE the air meter using MAF fueling tables to increase fuel pressure to compensate for additional oxygen provided by nitrous.
- This system relies upon the fuel injection systems normal delivery method to increase fuel to meet nitrous demand. In this case the nitrous system mechanically raises fuel pressure in the system to increase flow per injector pulse. This method relies upon specific knowledge of the capacity of the injector’s duty cycle and fuel delivery system. Both pump and injectors must be adequate to flow the needed fuel.
- This system will inject nitrous only into the intake tract before the air meter and relies upon MAF readings to properly change injector operation to flow the additional fuel. No fuel is added to the manifold outside of normal operation of the injectors.
- Typically due the to the nitrous being injected far before the point where fuel is injected, the fuel ratio tends to tip rich first and then is corrected quickly there after once the nitrous reaches the cylinder. The delivery time is slower leading to a less noticeable activation point (This is the "soft hit")
- Both nitrous and fuel pressure are essential to proper performance and tuning, however, should nitrous pressure fall or nitrous concentration lower, the compensation will be on the rich side posing less potential danger.
I have run both and both are equally effective. Nitrous is simple BUT its simplicity is what can make it easy to misuse.
For a race application Wet is the most cost effective and a very accurate means of injection. IN race applications where fuel pressure and nitrous pressure are monitored and kept in check the benefits are great.
For street I prefer Dry. Lack of preparedness will not lead to the potential puddling and subsequent damage that can be attributed to such conditions as low bottle pressure or failure to open the bottle or sticky clogged fuel solenoids.
Any application can lead to motor failure if not properly kept in check. Maintaining you vehicle (frequent plug checks and system nitrous and fuel filter checks), understanding WHEN you can most effectively inject nitrous in the powerband and being able to pick out those noises or other symptoms of a mistuned or malfunctioning nitrous system are important in all cases.
Richard
08-01-2005, 04:15 PM
#6
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Where is everybody spraying the dry nitrous? Are you moving the MAF closer to the throttle body? I am not saying I am going dry just yet, it just seems like the best thing right now. I've only got 1k miles on the truck now. How is the tranny going to handle a 100 shot?
08-01-2005, 04:23 PM
#7
Alot of people move the MAF to the throttle body. Put a transgo hd-2 shift kit and servos in it and the tranny will live alot happier. Put a window switch on the mitrous so you dont spray through the shifts. I like wet cause its alot less touchy about the atmosphere its run in. IMO its safer to run a wet system if you have the right tuning of course. Do the tune and let them know what you are going to be doing. Get the tow/haul button setup for the nitrous so when you spray hit the t/h button and the tune will be set for the nitrous and the rest of the time you can get great gas mileage.
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08-01-2005, 10:27 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by skinnyVHO
Where is everybody spraying the dry nitrous? Are you moving the MAF closer to the throttle body? I am not saying I am going dry just yet, it just seems like the best thing right now. I've only got 1k miles on the truck now. How is the tranny going to handle a 100 shot?
08-02-2005, 05:40 AM
#9
Originally Posted by GoldenVelvet
I made my own intake out of items found in the plumbing section of Home Depot. My MAF had been moved inboard of its factory location. To do a Dry spray through type kit you need to have about 6" before the MAF.
08-02-2005, 09:29 AM
#10
I currently have my dry system setup similar to GV's. I built my own cia and relocated my maf to just before the 90 going into the throttle body. I plumbed my nozzle in the intake tube 12" before the meter.
Previous to this setup I had a K&N GenII and had a modified dry nozzle plumbed into the metal end of the filter which worked very well for several years.
Previous to this setup I had a K&N GenII and had a modified dry nozzle plumbed into the metal end of the filter which worked very well for several years.