Difference in power levels
Oct 9, 2005 | 06:24 PM
#12
no... I was asking
What do you think causes the +60 rwhp diff?
Im thinking more along the lines of what whitt is saying
"combination"
bigger bore
bigger chamber with more compression
and Im beginning to believe the LS6 intake is really letting it come alive on the top.
It would be interesting to see the graphs for both.
What do you think causes the +60 rwhp diff?
Im thinking more along the lines of what whitt is saying
"combination"
bigger bore
bigger chamber with more compression
and Im beginning to believe the LS6 intake is really letting it come alive on the top.
It would be interesting to see the graphs for both.
Oct 9, 2005 | 07:05 PM
#13
For our app though the truck intake is better since it gives us the torque down low that we need thats why i am using it on my 408. Thats just my opinion and Im a moron. I think its just the bigger engine, higher compression, maybe teh combustion chamber design. Drivetrain lose I have a hard tiem believeing that, thought f-bodys had 10 bolt rears, same 4L60E in the autos and come on a foot longer driveshaft, dont think there is really any hidden power there.
Oct 9, 2005 | 09:43 PM
#14
there are many things to consider as to why one makes more then the other.
with different years and different types of vehicles can be major changes.
air pick up
throttle body size
valve size
head flow
intake
cubic inch
injector size
fuel pump
exhaust manifolds
year model of PCM timing, fuel, and knock retard tables, and not for getting the tune is also different for each motor.
all are different in just a few years 1999 to 2005 cars and trucks.
that extra 60 horses for the 5.7 is from allot of different little things.
just go's to show even the little things add up in making horse power.
with different years and different types of vehicles can be major changes.
air pick up
throttle body size
valve size
head flow
intake
cubic inch
injector size
fuel pump
exhaust manifolds
year model of PCM timing, fuel, and knock retard tables, and not for getting the tune is also different for each motor.
all are different in just a few years 1999 to 2005 cars and trucks.
that extra 60 horses for the 5.7 is from allot of different little things.
just go's to show even the little things add up in making horse power.
Oct 10, 2005 | 12:57 PM
#15
I personally think the stock truck intake is a restriction. Not 60hp worth, but its part of the puzzle.
Cars have better bolt-ons mods than the trucks do, also cheaper I might add. Some of the headers the cars can choose from are awesome. Our best choices ASM/Dynatech/pacesetter... won't make the power theirs will.
As stated earlier, heavier drivetrain components and wheels/tires.
I also think the aluminum block will show less knock retard than an identically configured iron block. Part of that could be better heat disbursement of the aluminum block. But its my opinion that the GM knock sensors are more sensitive in the iron block than in aluminum.
No one has yet mentioned the crankshaft differences in the two motors. Wouldn't the lighter crank / pistons be good for some power?
The flat top piston will have a better quench effect compared to the 5.3 piston with its full circle dished top. The majority of the quench area under the cylinder head in the 5.3 is in the dish area, which really reduces its effectiveness. Theoretically, the 5.7 should have a more complete combustion.
Cars have better bolt-ons mods than the trucks do, also cheaper I might add. Some of the headers the cars can choose from are awesome. Our best choices ASM/Dynatech/pacesetter... won't make the power theirs will.
As stated earlier, heavier drivetrain components and wheels/tires.
I also think the aluminum block will show less knock retard than an identically configured iron block. Part of that could be better heat disbursement of the aluminum block. But its my opinion that the GM knock sensors are more sensitive in the iron block than in aluminum.
No one has yet mentioned the crankshaft differences in the two motors. Wouldn't the lighter crank / pistons be good for some power?
The flat top piston will have a better quench effect compared to the 5.3 piston with its full circle dished top. The majority of the quench area under the cylinder head in the 5.3 is in the dish area, which really reduces its effectiveness. Theoretically, the 5.7 should have a more complete combustion.
Nov 19, 2005 | 10:29 AM
#16
Originally Posted by BigTex
I personally think the stock truck intake is a restriction. Not 60hp worth, but its part of the puzzle.
Cars have better bolt-ons mods than the trucks do, also cheaper I might add. Some of the headers the cars can choose from are awesome. Our best choices ASM/Dynatech/pacesetter... won't make the power theirs will.
As stated earlier, heavier drivetrain components and wheels/tires.
I also think the aluminum block will show less knock retard than an identically configured iron block. Part of that could be better heat disbursement of the aluminum block. But its my opinion that the GM knock sensors are more sensitive in the iron block than in aluminum.
No one has yet mentioned the crankshaft differences in the two motors. Wouldn't the lighter crank / pistons be good for some power?
The flat top piston will have a better quench effect compared to the 5.3 piston with its full circle dished top. The majority of the quench area under the cylinder head in the 5.3 is in the dish area, which really reduces its effectiveness. Theoretically, the 5.7 should have a more complete combustion.
Cars have better bolt-ons mods than the trucks do, also cheaper I might add. Some of the headers the cars can choose from are awesome. Our best choices ASM/Dynatech/pacesetter... won't make the power theirs will.
As stated earlier, heavier drivetrain components and wheels/tires.
I also think the aluminum block will show less knock retard than an identically configured iron block. Part of that could be better heat disbursement of the aluminum block. But its my opinion that the GM knock sensors are more sensitive in the iron block than in aluminum.
No one has yet mentioned the crankshaft differences in the two motors. Wouldn't the lighter crank / pistons be good for some power?
The flat top piston will have a better quench effect compared to the 5.3 piston with its full circle dished top. The majority of the quench area under the cylinder head in the 5.3 is in the dish area, which really reduces its effectiveness. Theoretically, the 5.7 should have a more complete combustion.
what about the new hooker header, it's expensive...... but does it maybe give us the same advantage the cars get in headers? they're reall long it seems.
also..... i really like your complete combustion theory. It definatly makes sense. how much nicer is the combustion chamber on ls1? maybe a 5.7 head swap onto a 5.3?
Nov 19, 2005 | 06:26 PM
#17
Launching!
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Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Hammond La
dont know if nebody mentioned this but maybe diffrent coil designs,pcv style, accessories routing and design like the p/s pump might be a heavier duty design for more of a load (larger tires and such) just my 2 cents not worth a penny
Nov 21, 2005 | 02:21 PM
#18
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,842
Likes: 0
From: Dallas, North Mexico
displacement- duh
bore- allows for better airflow
ion: 9:1 vs 10.5:1 ? yeah, thats a big deal
Tuning- I'm sure its more agressive in the LS1?
compression becomes more and more and important when your ratio is low. And with a bigger cam, the effective/dynamic compression is lower. (ie, 3:1 vs 4:1 is a bigger deal than 10:1 vs 11:1)
bore- allows for better airflow
ion: 9:1 vs 10.5:1 ? yeah, thats a big deal
Tuning- I'm sure its more agressive in the LS1?
compression becomes more and more and important when your ratio is low. And with a bigger cam, the effective/dynamic compression is lower. (ie, 3:1 vs 4:1 is a bigger deal than 10:1 vs 11:1)
Nov 21, 2005 | 02:22 PM
#19
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,842
Likes: 0
From: Dallas, North Mexico
Originally Posted by BigTex
I personally think the stock truck intake is a restriction. Not 60hp worth, but its part of the puzzle.
Cars have better bolt-ons mods than the trucks do, also cheaper I might add. Some of the headers the cars can choose from are awesome. Our best choices ASM/Dynatech/pacesetter... won't make the power theirs will.
As stated earlier, heavier drivetrain components and wheels/tires.
I also think the aluminum block will show less knock retard than an identically configured iron block. Part of that could be better heat disbursement of the aluminum block. But its my opinion that the GM knock sensors are more sensitive in the iron block than in aluminum.
No one has yet mentioned the crankshaft differences in the two motors. Wouldn't the lighter crank / pistons be good for some power?
The flat top piston will have a better quench effect compared to the 5.3 piston with its full circle dished top. The majority of the quench area under the cylinder head in the 5.3 is in the dish area, which really reduces its effectiveness. Theoretically, the 5.7 should have a more complete combustion.
Cars have better bolt-ons mods than the trucks do, also cheaper I might add. Some of the headers the cars can choose from are awesome. Our best choices ASM/Dynatech/pacesetter... won't make the power theirs will.
As stated earlier, heavier drivetrain components and wheels/tires.
I also think the aluminum block will show less knock retard than an identically configured iron block. Part of that could be better heat disbursement of the aluminum block. But its my opinion that the GM knock sensors are more sensitive in the iron block than in aluminum.
No one has yet mentioned the crankshaft differences in the two motors. Wouldn't the lighter crank / pistons be good for some power?
The flat top piston will have a better quench effect compared to the 5.3 piston with its full circle dished top. The majority of the quench area under the cylinder head in the 5.3 is in the dish area, which really reduces its effectiveness. Theoretically, the 5.7 should have a more complete combustion.
Nov 21, 2005 | 06:11 PM
#20
Adkoonerstrator
iTrader: (4)
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From: Deep in the seedy underworld of Koonerville
Originally Posted by treyZ28
aluminum blocks actually make less power.
The LS1 definately has a more aggressive tune but, I think it may have something to do with the weight of the two vehicles the engines are hauling around also. I know my sensors started showing knock with a total of only 22-23 degrees of timing on my new truck while an Fbody can run as much as 28-30 in stock trim.
I agree with alot of what BigTex said above.
1slowZ71 - A longer(heavier) driveshaft can definately account for a few hp.
