Tommy42088

mine is a 2wd so I plan to launch this thing at minimum of 3800 rpm so I definitely need a transmission that can take that.
Current setup
Sbe 5.3 with 243 heads cnc port polished and milled .04 with btr stage 3 truck cam , with 102mm intake & throttle body with cx racing 76mm kit( although the kit was horrible and I just about had to remake everything on the hot side) and this turbo is only .83 ar and for fueling I'm on e85 using dual aeromotive 340's and I got some 80lb injectors from huron speed, transmission is 4l65e with 3800pct converter, also I had 411 gears but I got rid of them and went 342 and it helped my top end alot. Also my exhaust is 3 inch with a cutoff and a magnaflow buffer
*Changes will be
Vr racing 78/75 billet g2.5 series turbo with 1.25 ar and all exhaust will be removed and 4 inch exhaust exit will be coming out the corner of the front bumper, also I've talked to enough people that I've decided on the 4l80 so that will be installed with a circle d pro series 245mm torque converter(triple disk) and im in the 16-17 psi range on the current setup so I plan to stay around that.

MaroonMonsterLS1

Like I said, 60e is capable, 80e is going to be more than capable.
For a proper 4l80e build at 800hp a rebuild will be needed there.
You'll probably double the cost of a "built" 60e when doing a proper 4l80e swap.
Sure you can go the "junkyard" route like sloppy mechanics (this is no slam on sloppy...I've written most of the 4l80e tech info on their wiki) but I wouldn't consider a junkyard unit with an HD2 a *proper* swap.

Also, since I do build transmissions daily...I can say that a 4l80e is not bulletproof. They're susceptible to wear and failure just like anything else. And with the age of cores now a days, the condition is a huge crapshoot on most used units. I'm replacing lots of stuff when I go through them to make them a proper performance unit.

Tommy42088

and that's what's make it so debatable because I can get a really well build 60e for around 3 grand and all ive have to do is send my converter to pct and let them go through it and go ahead and re stall it and it's a done deal vs the 80e I'll spend more like 5 grand easily doing it the right way. I'm not building a Nascar here so if the 60 is capable then I'd be OK with it. Plus I definitely like the gearing in the 60 much better then the 80. The way the builder explained it to me is that alot of people build 60e that don't really know what there doing and it gets a bad reputation from that plus its the most common transmission so it's going to be talked about the most but a solid builder can definitely make it work.

strutaeng

The gearing of each transmission is probably debatable. Yes, the 60e has a numerically higher first gear than the 80e, but if you look at drop ratio difference, I feel the 80e is better overall unit.

Why that huge ratio drop 1-2 on the 4L60e is a mystery to me. My guess is it was just a carryover design from the 700R4 when HP ratings of the late 1980s were still suffering from the Smog era restrictions? Even the TH350 has ratios closer to the TH400/4L80e.

IIRC, compared to the other transmissions from Ford and Chrysler of that generation, the 700R4/4L60/4L60e actually sticks out on the ratios for steeper 1st and larger ratio difference vs 2nd. 🤷

From a strength standpoint, the 4L80e's main design advantage is the bolted center support. Yes, it's big and heavy and overbuilt overall: It was designed as workhorse doing heavy hauling/towing. But I'll personally take overbuilt over marginal in a transmission (talking stock form), and I'm just driving around with a bone stock engine 🙊. In real honesty, it's because I can't afford the expensive internals of the 4L60e in my 1500. But on my 2500 trucks, that's not even an option.

MaroonMonsterLS1

The reason for the ratio drop in a 60e is because of how the compound planetary works.
the 4l60e is a "4 speed" transmission

Well what it's really doing is
Low=1st gear
Low Overdrive =2nd
High=3rd
High Overdrive=4th

OD ratio for the 60e is .7

So for 1st gear you have 3.06
2nd is [(3.06-1) * (1-0.7)] + 1= 1.618

That's why when you use the sonnax 2.84 ratio input carrier
Your 2nd gear ratio changes using the same math

[(2.84-1) * (1-0.7)] + 1= 1.552

I digress from the original question of this thread.
IMO the 60e can be plenty robust for most all half ton builds even with mild power adders.
Your typical 450-550hp turbo truck will have 0 issue with a well built 60e
550-700hp the 60e can still last but you get into the conversation point of does it make financial sense. Often you can add a few parts to the 60e to make it live a long life and be reliable (i.e. 4l79 drum) and the cost there will still be less than an 80e swap so it's often how my customers decide to spend their money

After 700 it's almost always a better idea to build and swap in an 80e
That's not to say the 60e CAN'T survive at that power level. They can. They have. I'll still build them for that. But for the Money...the 80e swap is the better option and will be less hassle in the long run.

The 80e has alot going for it. Bolted center support is on the list but not at the top IMO
the 80e is a simpson planetary with "stacked clutch" design. Meaning you just add a clutch for each gear. whereas the 60e is a "synchronous shift" unit. Meaning for the 2-3 shift it has to release one element (band) while applying another element (3-4 clutch)
This timing is one of the biggest issues with quality shift feel and long life.
The 80e also has physically larger...everything. Hydraulic apply. Friction surface. planetary. pump. yadda yadda.

To summarize...IMO
0-550hp should almost always get a 60e. especially in 4wd applications.
550-700 you can go either way. Financially a 60e often makes more sense but an 80e is justified
700+ it's hard to justify the 60e and the 80e is the wise choice.

This is the opinion of someone who builds these and warranties them...so my interest is not just in making a sale. But not having to deal with any warranty issues either. And these have sortof been the ranges I've found to be in the best interest of the customer most often.

Straightlineasassin

So if you can depend on your trans shop and rebuilder then there are cases where you can run a built 4l60 reliably. However with the ls engine platform and turbo tech making the kind of power and torque they are capable of it may just be better to go 4l80e swap. Imo horsepower is addictive like tattoos and you just keep adding so I am not convinced that building a 60 over an 80 would be the thing to do. Especially when you are likely to add even more hp to the equation in the future.

Tommy42088

Well I guess I in a ways went against the grain then but I ultimately decided to go with a 60, I don't want to say people's name on other sites but he's a very well known transmission builder and lots of guys give him praise on ls1 tech. Looks to be a 4l60 wizard, really transmissions in general and he was pretty reassuring that he could build me a 60 that would last. I went that route and ordered a 258 pro series torque converter from circle d 3700-3800 stall.

MaroonMonsterLS1

If you went with who I think you might have. You'll be pleasantly surprised I feel. He's VERY reasonable on price and has a proven track record.
Shoot me a PM if you'd like to discuss. I'm guessing a level 3...maybe level 4?
Either way. For the price and how easy the install will be vs an 80e swap...it's a good choice. Hope it lasts a while for you

Tommy42088

your guessing the right person, we had many conversations about it and as much as everyone told me not to do it the things he said made alot of sense and i ultimately trusted his word and went with it.

MaroonMonsterLS1

Level 3 or 4?