Turbo FOR towing (not AND towing)...ala Ecoboost
10-02-2014, 08:34 AM
#21
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Thanks guys. I really appreciate the input.
I'm no pro at tuning, but I've not a pure green novice. I've tuned my current setup and it runs VERY well IMO. Whenever we pull the 5'er my wife thinks I'm nuts but I always plug in my scanner then I spend some time at camp by the fire with a JD in my hand going over my tune and optimising my spark tables/shift points etc...
I totally get the 0" vacuum thing too. I really think that even 1lb of boost in many situations would make all the difference between a downshift or not.
My setup would definitely include wideband and EGT monitoring, and I'll install a water/meth system as well. I really think this can work. I don't tow very often, just for play. If I towed heavy and often I'd for sure look to a diesel. But I think with a 83mm exhaust turbine this would work very well and be fun to boot.
I'm no pro at tuning, but I've not a pure green novice. I've tuned my current setup and it runs VERY well IMO. Whenever we pull the 5'er my wife thinks I'm nuts but I always plug in my scanner then I spend some time at camp by the fire with a JD in my hand going over my tune and optimising my spark tables/shift points etc...
I totally get the 0" vacuum thing too. I really think that even 1lb of boost in many situations would make all the difference between a downshift or not.
My setup would definitely include wideband and EGT monitoring, and I'll install a water/meth system as well. I really think this can work. I don't tow very often, just for play. If I towed heavy and often I'd for sure look to a diesel. But I think with a 83mm exhaust turbine this would work very well and be fun to boot.
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jaydubb (02-03-2022)
10-02-2014, 10:05 AM
#23
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^^^^haha. Yeah I haven't ruled that out completely. In fact I was talking to a local tuner yesterday and he said "why don't you just do a blower?" But he agrees with me on my opinion that turbos have a "coolness" factor that IMO a blower doesn't have. I feel like I'm willing to put in the extra time and effort that a turbo may need to work the way I want it to.
10-16-2014, 08:16 AM
#24
I can't help you with turbo sizing but I have 1 2003 Silverado 2500 HD 6.0 L 4l80 4.10 gears (towing package, I tow 28 ft Haulmark ~10,000 trailer.
Since 2012, I now tow with a 2012 F150 Ecoboost the same trailer. The ecoboost is awesome and I can actually tow with cruise control up and down hills, my take is it's the combination of the turbos AND the 6 speed transmission that make a huge difference. I used HP Tuners to log with the Silverado and most towing was in 2000-2500 rpm range and delivered torque was in the 200-240 ft lbs range in the logs. The Ecoboost is right there with the turbo sizing and goes to 0 vaccum and low boost quickly, although at big hills and large loads I do hit 12 # boost. The 6 speed transmission keeps the truck in 6th with some drops to 5th and 4rth in large hills, but gone are the days with the 6.0 lt and 4l80e of a little road grade change dropping to 3rd and waamm, waamm that use to drive me nuts when she would drop to 3rd and hit 3500-4000 rpms! Towing (including a cross country trip) with gas pedal only was not fun! My friends that upgraded to newer Silverados with 6 speed transmissions can use cruise towing without the nerve wracking downshifts.
With the ecoboost I use Torque phone app to keep tabs on exhaust temps and on large hills I have hit 1680-1690 f a few times but then drops a bit. Mike from 5 Star said it's because there's fueling that kicks in to cool the cats and unless I get to 1750+ it should be OK. My truck has been stock because of extended warranty concerns keeps me from getting a tune. My recomendation is get turbo sizing from an expert and yes keep an eye on the exhaust temps.
As an interesting side note the towing mpg is not much different between the 6 ltr Silverado and the ecoboost because the ecoboost is in boost most of the time. A 3.5 ltr with 12 lbs boost is breathing just shy of a 7.0 ltr NA. the difference is MPG unloaded where the Silverado was 13-14 mpg at it's most of the time and the ecoboost with 3.73 towing package hit's 20.5 mpg regularly with the type of driving I do. If I was to do city driving mostly the Silverado was ~11 mpg, the Ecoboost 16-18 mpg. To get mpg on both but specially with a turbo I have to drive like I have egg shells under the pedal.
I will be testing Boost maxx and Pedal maxx by JMS Chips as it's not a tune and will be playing with alcohol or propane injection to see if I can get the towing mpg better in the future. With the ecoboost I now pass semis on the hills instead of being passed by them!
Hope this helps.
Carlos
Since 2012, I now tow with a 2012 F150 Ecoboost the same trailer. The ecoboost is awesome and I can actually tow with cruise control up and down hills, my take is it's the combination of the turbos AND the 6 speed transmission that make a huge difference. I used HP Tuners to log with the Silverado and most towing was in 2000-2500 rpm range and delivered torque was in the 200-240 ft lbs range in the logs. The Ecoboost is right there with the turbo sizing and goes to 0 vaccum and low boost quickly, although at big hills and large loads I do hit 12 # boost. The 6 speed transmission keeps the truck in 6th with some drops to 5th and 4rth in large hills, but gone are the days with the 6.0 lt and 4l80e of a little road grade change dropping to 3rd and waamm, waamm that use to drive me nuts when she would drop to 3rd and hit 3500-4000 rpms! Towing (including a cross country trip) with gas pedal only was not fun! My friends that upgraded to newer Silverados with 6 speed transmissions can use cruise towing without the nerve wracking downshifts.
With the ecoboost I use Torque phone app to keep tabs on exhaust temps and on large hills I have hit 1680-1690 f a few times but then drops a bit. Mike from 5 Star said it's because there's fueling that kicks in to cool the cats and unless I get to 1750+ it should be OK. My truck has been stock because of extended warranty concerns keeps me from getting a tune. My recomendation is get turbo sizing from an expert and yes keep an eye on the exhaust temps.
As an interesting side note the towing mpg is not much different between the 6 ltr Silverado and the ecoboost because the ecoboost is in boost most of the time. A 3.5 ltr with 12 lbs boost is breathing just shy of a 7.0 ltr NA. the difference is MPG unloaded where the Silverado was 13-14 mpg at it's most of the time and the ecoboost with 3.73 towing package hit's 20.5 mpg regularly with the type of driving I do. If I was to do city driving mostly the Silverado was ~11 mpg, the Ecoboost 16-18 mpg. To get mpg on both but specially with a turbo I have to drive like I have egg shells under the pedal.
I will be testing Boost maxx and Pedal maxx by JMS Chips as it's not a tune and will be playing with alcohol or propane injection to see if I can get the towing mpg better in the future. With the ecoboost I now pass semis on the hills instead of being passed by them!
Hope this helps.
Carlos
10-16-2014, 08:28 AM
#25
If I was to upgrade the Silvy which I did consider the easiest would be a gear vendors overdrive, and an Edelbrock supercharger, although a I do love turbos. By the time I added up all the costs it was easier and better to with the ecoboost. I did upgrade the rear suspension on the 1/2 ton with air bags and Hellwig helper springs vs just airbags for the Silvy HD. The 10 year tech advance difference between the trucks is quite evident.
04-07-2015, 10:22 AM
#27
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My current truck has taught me that a bolt-on 6.0 LQ4 can take A LOT of abuse and just shrug it off. I love these things.
05-19-2015, 01:27 AM
#28
I know this thread is already old, but, - I had my 01 Suburban turboe'd for 15k ish miles, and I did it just for towing purposes. You do not need a huge turbo for towing, I disagree there. I had an On3 70mm (.96 hotside) with the KB manifold, stock engine with ls6 springs ( it had 190k on it so cheap insurance) I did it just for pulling big trailers from low to high elevation. 4-8k feet. Naturally aspirated it could barely do it. I had a $230 Stock size revmax converter and the 4l60e built. It felt and towed like a big block. It was awesome, and I went from 7.5 mpg to almost 9 towing the same thing the same trip. The difference was staying at speed and not dropping out of overdrive when towing. It was awesome! And unloaded was a hoot to drive. It was my version of a poor mans ecoboost > Those things rock for towing @ high elevation like was mentioned.
I had an Air to water intercooler system on it. 90+ degrees out with high humidity pulling the IAT's were 125. I didnt think that was too bad.
I dismantled the set up because I have a Cummins, and just didnt drive the Suburban anymore. The tuning has to be set up a bit for towing so its not rich all the time in boost with little throttle, it was tricky to set up to where I liked it. Simplicity though, get a blower
I had an Air to water intercooler system on it. 90+ degrees out with high humidity pulling the IAT's were 125. I didnt think that was too bad.
I dismantled the set up because I have a Cummins, and just didnt drive the Suburban anymore. The tuning has to be set up a bit for towing so its not rich all the time in boost with little throttle, it was tricky to set up to where I liked it. Simplicity though, get a blower
05-20-2015, 05:41 PM
#29
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I know this thread is already old, but, - I had my 01 Suburban turboe'd for 15k ish miles, and I did it just for towing purposes. You do not need a huge turbo for towing, I disagree there. I had an On3 70mm (.96 hotside) with the KB manifold, stock engine with ls6 springs ( it had 190k on it so cheap insurance) I did it just for pulling big trailers from low to high elevation. 4-8k feet. Naturally aspirated it could barely do it. I had a $230 Stock size revmax converter and the 4l60e built. It felt and towed like a big block. It was awesome, and I went from 7.5 mpg to almost 9 towing the same thing the same trip. The difference was staying at speed and not dropping out of overdrive when towing. It was awesome! And unloaded was a hoot to drive. It was my version of a poor mans ecoboost > Those things rock for towing @ high elevation like was mentioned.
I had an Air to water intercooler system on it. 90+ degrees out with high humidity pulling the IAT's were 125. I didnt think that was too bad.
I dismantled the set up because I have a Cummins, and just didnt drive the Suburban anymore. The tuning has to be set up a bit for towing so its not rich all the time in boost with little throttle, it was tricky to set up to where I liked it. Simplicity though, get a blower
I had an Air to water intercooler system on it. 90+ degrees out with high humidity pulling the IAT's were 125. I didnt think that was too bad.
I dismantled the set up because I have a Cummins, and just didnt drive the Suburban anymore. The tuning has to be set up a bit for towing so its not rich all the time in boost with little throttle, it was tricky to set up to where I liked it. Simplicity though, get a blower
05-20-2015, 09:58 PM
#30
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I've done a bit of towing with my turbocharged Colorado. In my opinion, turbos are king when it comes to towing. That's why diesels feel the way they do. Nothing really magic about diesel, it's the turbo that's giving all the low rpm torque (if you've ever driven a N/A diesel you know what I mean).
Anyway, the little 2.9L 4 cylinder Colorado would hold 9psi, 2100rpm, and 65mph up every hill I climbed. Sometimes for miles at a time.
Anyway, the little 2.9L 4 cylinder Colorado would hold 9psi, 2100rpm, and 65mph up every hill I climbed. Sometimes for miles at a time.
Last edited by JGTurbo; 05-20-2015 at 10:06 PM.