How cold is too cold?
 

My fellow geeks and I were discussing this at work today. But how cold is too cold for the intake charge? Assuming you could keep most of the condensation out of the air, is it possible for the air to be too cold? :confused:

I know by using the old butt dyno my N/A truck runs a ton better during the winters here than in the summer. We were just wondering how much power could be gained with cold ass air.

The subject of fuel cooling came up too.

So what do you think? :D

I'm pretty sure that too cold would be below the freezing point of gasoline, in other words, no.

I drove in -20 degree weather before the Turbo install and at about zero after and had no issues here!
It gets pretty cold up here.

What were your IAT's? Did you feel a noticable power gain vs. like an 80 or 90 degree day?

would putting a baggie of ice in next to the intake (if you have open element syle) help out 1/4 mile times on a hot day?

I think what you mean is how dense the air. Of course the colder the air, the denser the air, assuming you are at the same elevation. Take for example NOx, nitrous does not make the air colder it provides a denser air (oxygen) charge even though nitrous is cold, this is due to the rapid expansion of NOx leaving the nozzle, same principle as your A/C.

But this is not always so, take a carburated vehicle that is jetted really close to perfect at sea level (temperature 80-90), then drive it to the mountain (temp 60-70, elevation +6,000 feet). The car or truck will run very rich when you arrive at the moutains even though the temperature is colder, so jetting is required to bring the performance back up, EFI are capable of motoring fuel/air mixture more precise. This is because air is less dense at higher elevation than at lower elevation.

So to ask your question how cold is too cold for the intake charge, that depends on what the intake charge is. (you might be thinking wtf, this guy is nuts or been smoking something) I do have to agree with MikeGuyver assuming you are at the same elevation.

Here is thought on how to get your air temperature down, really down, run liquid nitrogen through a heat exchanger, just like an air/water intercooler.

Oh I'm not worried about getting the temp down, I have my own ideas about that. If everything works out I'll share them with ya'll.

I was assuming the same elevation, sorry I didn't clarify that. Plus I don't think nitrous is a good comparrison. When it exits the nozzle it undergoes a phase change, and it DOES cool off the intake charge considrably. Hence freezing of the MAF on dry shots.

Should I even ask what a couple of ME (notice your profile) came up with, this should be a no brainer for any engineer.

There's CO2 system that puts a venturi with a CO2 chilled element into the intake tract to lower the intake air charge.The same company uses another element around the fuel line to chill fuel feeding the motor.

Yup seen that too setup too. This "idea".....more of a dream at this stage, is continuous. With the other designs out there, the CO2 and N2 are compressed. Once you release them, that's it. Unless you can recover it and compress it fast enough to start the cycle over, its a one shot deal. Kinda like a shot of nitrous.

So no answers to how cold is too cold?

And no I'm not using the truck's AC system. Who wants to have to run their AC all the time. And besides it shuts off under WOT. :D