Who would you choose. Based off overall features and reliabilty.

Good poll! I wonder the same. Im kind of leaning toward HPtuners, but EFI Live looks good to.

Edit sucks.

HPT is totally adequate. V2.0 will be a big improvement.

EFILive is clearly the most versatile package out there.

I have now played with all of them, and to me, EFILive is the easiest to use and has the better features.

Either way(HPT or EFILive) you will be OK.

Edit sucks.

HPT is totally adequate. V2.0 will be a big improvement.

EFILive is clearly the most versatile package out there.

I have now played with all of them, and to me, EFILive is the easiest to use and has the better features.

Either way(HPT or EFILive) you will be OK.

I'll reserve my opinion until after you get EFI and I get Ver 2.0, that will be a better comparo.

i still dont see how EFILive's current product(which has been out for months) should be compared to V2, which has been promised since January. I like HPT, but comparing a product that is not available to the general public, to EFILive, seems silly?

Do you see my point?

Again, I like HPT. It works great. I just think that it is overpriced for V1.7, and clearly their release schedule and pay for updates scheme is bullshit.

i still dont see how EFILive's current product(which has been out for months) should be compared to V2, which has been promised since January. I like HPT, but comparing a product that is not available to the general public, to EFILive, seems silly?

Do you see my point?

Again, I like HPT. It works great. I just think that it is overpriced for V1.7, and clearly their release schedule and pay for updates scheme is bullshit.

I said after we both have our product?

I may be silly, however I don't think it is unreasonable to wait until V2 comes out to compare them. I would hope at that point both companies were marketing their best product. Now, if V2 never happens, then HPT has more problems than just being the best.

Wow this is close

are all the people voting actual users?

If someone who has used EFI Live would be willing to post those features that HPT V1.7 does not have I would greatly appreciate it.

fwiw, I voted HPT, as Eye-P said, for what their product will be and I am a user.

are all the people voting actual users?

If someone who has used EFI Live would be willing to post those features that HPT V1.7 does not have I would greatly appreciate it.

fwiw, I voted HPT, as Eye-P said, for what their product will be and I am a user.


Learned shift properties for each shift. This is obviously the one I am most concerned with.

Free 2bar

Free custom O/S

Free lifetime updates

Blackbox logging

ability to read HPT .bin and ls1edit files

native USB support

edit works but i wish it had a scanner (that actually worked) their beta version sucks ne-1 of the edit users know if and when they are coming out with the updated version

I'd dont have either one, but the points I've read on both site lead me to say efiLive is the better choice.

Learned shift properties for each shift. This is obviously the one I am most concerned with.

Free 2bar

Free custom O/S

Free lifetime updates

Blackbox logging

ability to read HPT .bin and ls1edit files

native USB support

can't argue the freebies! that is awesome, maybe if EFI gets a larger following HPT will change policy to meet the market demand.
Hopefully in the long run, EFI's freebies will benefit both suites.

I have hpt and wish I would of looked more into efi live it seems to be the better choice. I have seen bigtex's efi live and looked at my hpt and wish I could of gotten efi live.

Oh yeah I use to have ls1edit a long long time ago that was the biggest waste of money for the service and updates that you had to pay for if they updated anything past like 6 months.

Ive got Edit. It works and serves its intended purpose.

That aside, how does Edit suck? Do you know how to use it? If tuning software was like using a Hypertech Im sure everybody would have it and it would be awesome. But its not. Majority of people who down Edit just plain dont know how to use it. Simple fact of the matter is, there is no idiot proof tuning software.

Ive got Edit. It works and serves its intended purpose.

That aside, how does Edit suck? Do you know how to use it? If tuning software was like using a Hypertech Im sure everybody would have it and it would be awesome. But its not. Majority of people who down Edit just plain dont know how to use it. Simple fact of the matter is, there is no idiot proof tuning software.

I do know how to use the software granted I did have an older version of edit I just wasn't pleased with it compared to hpt.

Ive got Edit. It works and serves its intended purpose.

That aside, how does Edit suck? Do you know how to use it? If tuning software was like using a Hypertech Im sure everybody would have it and it would be awesome. But its not. Majority of people who down Edit just plain dont know how to use it. Simple fact of the matter is, there is no idiot proof tuning software.


Edit has a nasty habit of frying PCM's.
Edit CAN NOT recover bad flashes.
Edit does not offer custom O/S's.
Edit does not have a decent scanner.

I am not sure if you can use wideband with Edit or not.

Oh, and the layout sucks.

Come on I know we have more people to voice their thoughts than this.

I got hpt because I like the look, feel and instrinsic nature
plus alot of people have it and knowledge abounds

Edit has a nasty habit of frying PCM's.
Edit CAN NOT recover bad flashes.
Edit does not offer custom O/S's.
Edit does not have a decent scanner.

I am not sure if you can use wideband with Edit or not.

Oh, and the layout sucks.

Hey man. It works, like it or not. Ive been on this board for a long time and Missouri F-Body and I have yet to see somebody who fried a PCM. Im still on my ORIGINAL PCM. Thats right. I bought Edit way way before HPT was a twinkle in someones eye. Thus im not gonna drop another $500 bucks just to get another setup when Edit works fine. What software do you have? PP3 doesnt count. Have you actually used any of these packages to tune anything? Or have you based your insight on what you have read on the net? Just curious.

Edit still takes longer to flash than hpt. I don't know about everyone else, but time is money in my world. Plus, I've never replaced a pcm on anything, and I know of several burnt computers from edit. I have no experience with efilive, therefore I cannot make any comment pro or con, other than to say that they were not available when I first encountered tuning needs.

Hey man. It works, like it or not. Ive been on this board for a long time and Missouri F-Body and I have yet to see somebody who fried a PCM. Im still on my ORIGINAL PCM. Thats right. I bought Edit way way before HPT was a twinkle in someones eye. Thus im not gonna drop another $500 bucks just to get another setup when Edit works fine. What software do you have? PP3 doesnt count. Have you actually used any of these packages to tune anything? Or have you based your insight on what you have read on the net? Just curious.


Im glad its working for you.

Yes I have used HPT, as well as Edit. My current tune is my own, done with HPT.

I have been using EFILive for a few weeks now.

Thats what I based my opinion on.

I have EFILive with FlashScan and it is an awesome system. The tuning and scanning software along with the FlashScan hardware interface work like a hand in a glove, seamlessly. The tune compare features, helpful explanations for each parameter that can be tuned and hypertext cross references to other related parameters are excellent. The search feature of the tuner is a huge help. It goes without saying that the scanning software is without equal.

All my best,

Steve

Edit has a nasty habit of frying PCM's.
Edit CAN NOT recover bad flashes.
Edit does not offer custom O/S's.
Edit does not have a decent scanner.

I am not sure if you can use wideband with Edit or not.

Oh, and the layout sucks.

you left out:

have to pay for updates

is slow

can't copy/paste anything

I was an Edit user since it first hit the market a few years back. At that time, it was the only custom product. Too bad they haven't made any progress since then. I waited over two years for them to figure out the 03+ model truck tuning problems, and they never have. Carputing recently wanted me to pay for upgrades to my 03 software thats not even fully functional. They can't figure it out and get it right, but still want me to pay the upgrade fee. BS! It served its purpose well in the past, but has been completely surpassed in features and quality by both EFI and HPT.

I've been using EFI for 5 months now. Its GREAT. So much better than Edit. As Steve said, the scanning is without equal. It works consistently and its reliable. I would absolutely spend the money on it again. I used the EFI Live product to scan and log for a couple of years, and can say without a doubt its the best. There are so many tuning features available for my truck that Edit didn't have access to. When I first went through my PCM, I couldn't believe how much control I had over it. Edit was so restrictive in comparison. Adding additional tuning licenses can be done over the net. Edit required you to send it in and pay an additional handling fee on top of the license fee.

I don't own HPT, but I do think its a good product. I don't like the pay for upgrades scheme, since thats what Edit did. I've been hearing about 2-3bar tuning with HPT foe a long time now, but still haven't seen results. EFI was able to bring it out pretty quick since they had already been tuning that way in Australia for several years. I do like HPTs unlimited tuning for like make/model vehicles. From my limited use of the product, its got a pretty full feature set too.

Having used all three at some point, I still would choose EFI as my tuning package. I would definitely choose HPT over Edit every day of the week.

i had hptuners and a nelson tune. i could log and tweek things at will. but i thought that it would have been nice to be able to log more things. i think that if efi live can log all that it does in the scanning software and then be able to tune then that would be the shit. i guess the one nice thing on hptuners is i had 03 and 02 on mine. i could tune all 03 and 02 trucks. as many as i wanted.

Man I Am Glad You'll Did This I Have Been Unable To Figure Out Witch Way To Hptuner,efi. I Can Get Efilive Realy Cheap And I Just Did Not Know Witch Was The Best.

I use HPT..

i could tune all 03 and 02 trucks. as many as i wanted.

Isn't their software year AND model specific? You had it for an 02 Sierra, so you couldn't tune an 02 Silverado, correct?

With EFI, I can tune any LS1 based vehicle. In fact, I can load up any VIN or flash on my PCM and run it in a different vehicle under the same license. That would allow mw to sell my 03 truck and use the same PCM on a newer model truck or SUV if I desired.

I have the Commercial Version of EFILive with FlashScan which allows me to do a full flash of the operating system and I've done this (twice in fact). I switched over to a 2001 operating system in order to have access to all of the cells of the Main VE Table and eliminates the back up VE Table. Then I did a second full flash to a custom EFILive OS version which gives me more flexibility in setting up the high octane spark table to fully eliminate knock retard. The simultaneous logging of wideband O2 as a parameter is invaluable in setting up both the VE table and the MAF values as well as determining if you are getting knock retard due to a lean mixture or due to too much spark advance.

Steve

Isn't their software year AND model specific? You had it for an 02 Sierra, so you couldn't tune an 02 Silverado, correct?

With EFI, I can tune any LS1 based vehicle. In fact, I can load up any VIN or flash on my PCM and run it in a different vehicle under the same license. That would allow mw to sell my 03 truck and use the same PCM on a newer model truck or SUV if I desired.

I would like to know this as well. I was leaning towards the HP because of the dual year thing, but if you can tune any vehicle with the EFI Live, that would be the shiz. I want tweek my truck and my fathers truck.......

I would like to know this as well. I was leaning towards the HP because of the dual year thing, but if you can tune any vehicle with the EFI Live, that would be the shiz. I want tweek my truck and my fathers truck.......

EFILive can tune any year truck. When you buy Flashscan, you get 2 vehicle licenses, regardless of year.

You will be able to read and modify as many .bin and .tun files as you like, but you can only Flash 2 PCM's with the standard license.

Excellent. Can you and how much does it cost to add licenses? For example if i purchase a new truck. Or do you have to upgrade to the professional versions, etc?

Excellent. Can you and how much does it cost to add licenses? For example if i purchase a new truck. Or do you have to upgrade to the professional versions, etc?


Licenses are $99 a piece. You will not have to upgrade to the pro version.

www.efilive.com
www.wait4meperformance.com

I bought EFI-live V6 scanner when it came out to scan with.
I tune my '98 PCM with edit, only because flashscan doesnt support '98's.....YET

When V7 came out I upgraded within the "30 days" and they gave me 4 licences. All that for a $200 upgrade.


Learned shift properties for each shift. This is obviously the one I am most concerned with.

Free 2bar

Free custom O/S

Free lifetime updates

Blackbox logging

ability to read HPT .bin and ls1edit files

native USB supportThis covers everything, except.....
you can tune ANY LS-based PCM, you are not limited to year/body style
AND! up to 16 licences per flashcscan box.

I bought EFI-live V6 scanner when it came out to scan with.
I tune my '98 PCM with edit, only because flashscan doesnt support '98's.....YET

When V7 came out I upgraded within the "30 days" and they gave me 4 licences. All that for a $200 upgrade.


This covers everything, except.....
you can tune ANY LS-based PCM, you are not limited to year/body style
AND! up to 16 licences per flashcscan box.

This sounds like the best package for tuning.

Have any opinions changed since HP came out with the update?

Got EFILive V7 recently. Gotta love it! Auto-tune is fun.

I used HPT with that new update. Maybe im the only one................. Not impressed.

i just order efi but don't know if i should have order hp.

So if you buy the Flashscan personal scan & tune package for $699, that's all I need to be able to tune up my own personal vehicle (01 Sierra 5.3) and one other LS1 based vehicle of my choice and each add vehicle license costs and add $99?? I am new to this, I just want to get this straight before I spend that kind of $$$ Plus I may go in on half with a friend w/ a diff year truck. THANKS!!

Yep, that's pretty much it. Read this post if you haven't already, lots of info on the cost and what you get.

http://www.performancetrucks.net/forums/showthread.php?t=353764

Cool post..

I'm sure that both sides can agree that many things have changed for all of us since this post was created.

If you've noticed, we've updated our forum over the past weekend:
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/

Few things that we have added are Ford, Dodge, GM L4 I5 and I6 as well as duramax sections..

This is really public knowledge as we have announced the release of these platforms already, but a friendly reminder won't hurt.

For about the past 6 months or so we have been working on our newest product release, our new USB interface which will have support for GM, Ford and Dodge vehicles. This includes all the current vehicles we support, the LS2, LS7, Duramax, Mustangs, Hemi's, etc. etc... the works. :)

More and more shops switch over to HP Tuners due to the fact that we simply offer you more options..

We will probably start taking orders on our new hardware and the LS2 products around christmas time.. and the LS7 shortly after that.

One of the neatest things about our new setup is, if you have support for whatever your vehicle may be, you can still scan any vehicle we support, gm, ford and dodge. Another thing you will not find with other tuning packages.

Our software also has the most user friendly and up to date user interface you will find. Now, reading that statement from a third person POV can seem pretty bold... but we have a lot of screenshots up to prove it.

You can view them here:
http://www.hptuners.com/products.html

Our product simply gives you more for your dollar.

If you have any questions, please feel free to e-mail me.

:usa:

- Keith, HP Tuners

Also, here are polls with the same question on other sites, to help you get a more general idea of what our customers think about our products:

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49002

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=415307

As you can see, customers are happy on both sides of the table... which makes your choices even harder...

So, just ask us some questions if you have any and we'll do what we can to help answer those for you to make sure you buy the right product for you. :)

- Keith, HP Tuners

I picked hpt & will stick with it because of

1. Their licensing
2. V6 tuning capabilities
3. Upcoming ford/chrysler/diesel tuning capabilities
4. Free Updates
5. Powerful fully customizable scanner
6. Great help files
7. Very user friendly
8. Their highest price personal unit is lower then efi's lowest price personal unit
9. Lower priced 1 bar OS
10. Competetively priced 2 bar OS
11. Also has an "auto tune" feature but with no spiffy nickname lol we just call it Speed density tuning
12. Soon to offer black box logging which will be able to scan other makes & models for no extra charge

alot of people bring up the custom OS's being free for efilive which ISN'T true...you pay $99 for each license and have to buy the commercial version to be able to program the 1/2/3 bar custom OS's on your own. Also after you've used 25 licenses you need to purchase a new unit which is another $699 or $850 out of pocket. I've tuned well over 25 cars now so I'd be in that boat. The free updates thing as well...hptuners has offered free updates if you bought your unit after mid October of 04' so they've offered this for over a year now.

I like the HPTuners license scheme way better
than EFILive because I work on other peoples'
cars with some regularity and have only a few
models I'm interested in - F-bodies, 'vettes and
trucks. If you wanted a low quantity, high mix
of model*year then EFILive might make more
sense. Individual VIN licenses are not that
expensive and you could charge the people who
use up your available slots but I can't rightly
remember how many local F-bodies I've touched
with my original '02 license anymore.

HPTuners licenses I have for trucks, let me do
'99 Sierra/Silverado and '04 Sierra/Silverado.
Where there is a Chevy/GMC or Chevy/Pontiac
"twin" they generally give you both, but if it's
a single-marque platform (like 'vette, Escalade,
etc.) then it's just the one.

when I made my purchase I made some pretty hard comparisons...
I weighed price..features..liscensing..and ability to make my money back from use.
at the time of my purchase EFI had a better scanner...but that was it...
Liscensing was on HPT was way better...
both had 2 liscenses free with purchase..but EFI's 2 were 2 vehicle ID's(meaning 2 cars)
and HPT was 2 vehicle types(meaning every car for that type and year)..well that instantly make HPT also have better money recoup ability...IF there were 3000 LS1 camaros made in the year 2000..I could tune every one of them if I wanted to at no aditional charge...EFI wanted $99/liscense...
that meant that with EFI I would have to charge $99 for a $10 turn off my o2's problem.
price up fron wa less with HPT as well..to get the same "pro" features I would spend $850 for EFI or just $650 with HPT...
so now they have released 2.0
and teh scanner is completely up to par with EFI...and they still have all the other great features winning..
all of my friends are F-body's, vette's, and trucks for hauling tehir toys around....
I righ now do all the F-bodys...and I have several vettes ready for a tune so thats going to get added....which will bring more vette business..and several truck buddys wanting teh same also...so its a merry lfe...
right now I have tuned well over teh 25 car limit/cable for EFI....
hmm..EFI...
850 for program...99/car for the other 23......fill it up..have to spend another 850.....
it just doesnt add up nicely to me...almost $3200 just on the first cable
with HPT....$650 for initial...+200 for first 2 purchased liscences...+400 for each aditional....and I have the ability to tune all fbodys ever made for less than $1500...

and when I tune a car...I dont lose $99 of that money to buying the liscense...so I recoup money much quicker...with HPT..buy a liscens and make it all back in 1 or 2 tunes..and make money from it on ebery other car I tune.

its getting to a point that I might be able to just tune cars..a coule a week and I could just do tunes and nothing else...I dont think I could get there with EFI

now I am also a beta tester for HPT and get to see stuff and make suggestions before it comes out....

HPT is releasing USB with black box logging capability....and its not just 20 minutes...when I do the math it looks like you will be able to do more than an hour and a half easy..maybe even close to 2 hours of logging....!!!@@#$#%#!~~~~!!!!!!

also coming with the new hardware is Ford and Dodge support....
more horsepower toys...
one of my buddies has a 2000 camaro race car..that he hauls with his Hemi Truck..and guess what...he has been waitig on buying parts cause he didnt see a good tuning option fo rhim...and now he is ordering the parts he wants cause he wants me to tune him with HPT....
another buddy with a mustang doesnt want to spend money for SCT stuff cause he has already bought Hpt and will be geting the usb hardware and a mustang liscense for his pony.

Its just an easy choice to me..and more logical to me....

Thanks to the experienced users of tuneing programs for posting. I, for one, certainly need your input before I spend that many $$. Appreciate it! Regards, JimS

it just doesnt add up nicely to me...almost $3200 just on the first cable
with HPT....$650 for initial...+200 for first 2 purchased liscences...+400 for each aditional....and I have the ability to tune all fbodys ever made for less than $1500...

and when I tune a car...I dont lose $99 of that money to buying the liscense...so I recoup money much quicker...with HPT..buy a liscens and make it all back in 1 or 2 tunes..and make money from it on ebery other car I tune.

its getting to a point that I might be able to just tune cars..a coule a week and I could just do tunes and nothing else...I dont think I could get there with EFI


Every liscense you purchase with EFI you get an $80 credit that goes toward the unlimited workshop package. Once you have tuned 75 then another $1000 and you are unlimited on liscenses. EFI allows you to tune cars and trucks and Duramax, where HPT is vehicle specific I believe. I'm going with EFI live.

I'm not sure what you mean vehicle specific.

Our current interface, you can tune GM V8's and GM V6's... all with the same interface.

Our new interface, you can tune GM V8's, GM V6's, GM L4's, GM I5 and I6's, LS2's, LS7's, Ford and Dodge vehicles..

You can add as many different licenses from different makes and models to your one interface/software setup.

- Keith, HP Tuners

I just want to know why a guy with a license for 2002 trucks 4.8,5.3, and 6.0 can't tune my Tahoe. What's the difference? Just a scam to make more sales? The PCM is the same correct? Suburbans?

Am I misinformed when I hear EFI will let me tune ANY 2002 Chevy/GMC 4.8,5.3,6.0 regardless of what body style is slapped on the frame?
I will never tune more than 25 cars/trucks.
I just want to do my current toy and be ready to do the next one which will be a 2005 something...and if a buddy wants help with his truck he just spends $99 to get the license, correct? How does HPT work in this situation?

I just want to know why a guy with a license for 2002 trucks 4.8,5.3, and 6.0 can't tune my Tahoe. What's the difference?

:lurk: Good point I dont have or know anyone with a tahoe but I always thought they should be grouped together myself.

I just want to know why a guy with a license for 2002 trucks 4.8,5.3, and 6.0 can't tune my Tahoe. What's the difference? Just a scam to make more sales? The PCM is the same correct? Suburbans?

Am I misinformed when I hear EFI will let me tune ANY 2002 Chevy/GMC 4.8,5.3,6.0 regardless of what body style is slapped on the frame?
I will never tune more than 25 cars/trucks.
I just want to do my current toy and be ready to do the next one which will be a 2005 something...and if a buddy wants help with his truck he just spends $99 to get the license, correct? How does HPT work in this situation?

When you purchase EFI, it comes with 2 liscenses, but you can tune F-body's, Vette's, Trucks (including Tahoes), and Duramax Diesel with the same program. You can put 25 liscenses on a cable and then after that just get a new cable, they are cheap. Free uprgrades too.

1SlowHoe, to answer your questions. Both companies have license schemes that are designed to make the company money, not lose money. It's not a scam at all.

If we did not put limits on our licenses, why would people continue to purchase through us? They wouldn't. They wouldn't have to and we both would go out of business.

EFI Lives license is a per vehicle license. What that means is once you use that license up on your truck, that license is locked to your individual truck. Only your truck.

Our license is a per model/year license. What that means is if you purchase a license for your 02 tahoe, you can tune an unlimited number of 02 tahoe's, not just your own.

Our license is a very open scheme. While in some models it may not be ideal, in other popular models it is.. For example, the f-body and the silverado/sierra market.. Many people have these cars, and know others with the same types of vehicles. If you have one of our licenses for a xx year of yy model, if your friend has the same xx year of yy model vehicle you can tune their vehicle as well without having to add more licenses to your support.

We also group several models together to make our license scheme more robust..

For example, we group the camaro's and firebirds into a single f-body license.
We group silverados and sierra's into a single license group.
We group suburbans and yukons.
We group Express and Savanna's.

We will be expanding the types of licenses we have available in the near future as well. You will definately have more options to chose from to pick the perfect product for you and your tuning needs.


Rhino79, HP Tuners has free upgrades as well.

The free updates thing as well...hptuners has offered free updates if you bought your unit after mid October of 04' so they've offered this for over a year now.
So those of us who supported HPT early on in their growth by purchasing before October '04 don't get free updates, is that what you're saying?

[QUOTE=Magnus]we will be expanding the types of licenses we have available in the near future as well. You will definately have more options to chose from to pick the perfect product for you and your tuning needs./QUOTE]

So does this mean you will be changing your pricing to add vehicles? When we order we get two vehicle types. If you add 2 more vehices its $199 each but after that its $399 each. Soon you will offer support for Ford, Chrysler and duramax. This can get real expensive if you dont have the cash up front to buy one of the tuner packages. I personaly would like to beable to buy them buy the block. Like all Silverado/Sierra 99-05 and or all F-body 99-05

So those of us who supported HPT early on in their growth by purchasing before October '04 don't get free updates, is that what you're saying?

At the time of your purchase there were two options hptuners & ls1edit...hptuners decided to go with a similar strategy with their updates....efilives tuning software came out about a year later offering free updates so hptuners matched it. The decided on a cutoff date & stuck with it. Once you pay the annual fee ONCE thats it & your set for life

[QUOTE=Magnus]we will be expanding the types of licenses we have available in the near future as well. You will definately have more options to chose from to pick the perfect product for you and your tuning needs./QUOTE]

So does this mean you will be changing your pricing to add vehicles? When we order we get two vehicle types. If you add 2 more vehices its $199 each but after that its $399 each. Soon you will offer support for Ford, Chrysler and duramax. This can get real expensive if you dont have the cash up front to buy one of the tuner packages. I personaly would like to beable to buy them buy the block. Like all Silverado/Sierra 99-05 and or all F-body 99-05

I dunno...their pricing structure changed after 1.6 was released if i remember correctly, slightly. With more competition between efilive, tunercats & ls1edit they might consider it. For my sake I hope so but nothing is guaranteed at this point. They did however lower their 2bar licensing by $100 recently so maybe thats a hint :shrug: